Things weren't better, no, but the people really were. The greatest generation actually were great, the baby boomers were (and are) pretty useless, gen X is much maligned but actually accomplished some things, and Gen Y is proving to be a pretty sorry lot so far.

8/16/2010 1:06:45 PM

but thats what is always said, hell they said the greatest generation was too soft to go to war too

8/16/2010 1:07:34 PM

^^Can't go along with that. Old people are the reason this country sucks. They've consistently put off inevitable pain so they could live in comfort. It's human nature: "I don't care what the world is like once I'm dead, so screw it." That's why we have a botched social safety net system. I was sentenced to a life of indentured servitude decades before I was even born. They've also stirred up hornet's nests all around the world, for the sake of "doing good," which has led to nothing but trouble.

I don't give a damn if they lived through the Great Depression or fought World War II. The game was rigged for Generation Y from the start. Yeah, in retrospect, you might say they overcame bad conditions. I think we're going to have to overcome something much worse, and it's because of the policies of past generations. No one was talking about how great the "greatest generation" was when they were growing up. It was only years later that the term was coined. If there will be a greatest generation, it will have to be this one, because we'll be forced to rebuild the republic from its smouldering ashes.

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 1:24 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 1:23:09 PM

What's the time frame for your paranoia so when that time comes you'll know you were wrong about the sky falling?

Not saying you're wrong per se, just wondering if such a day exists.

8/16/2010 1:27:38 PM

I don't understand how all of you liberals are supporting someone who refuses to condemn the terrorist organization Hamas.

8/16/2010 1:36:22 PM

Quote :

"I don't understand how all of you liberals are supporting someone who refuses to condemn the terrorist organization Hamas."

Is it his place to determine who is and who isn't a terrorist?

Or do you expect him to take his marching orders from American neo-conservatives, and simply adopt their narrative and categories?

8/16/2010 1:41:04 PM

So now it is a neo-conservative thing to condemn the terrorist group Hamas?

what in the fuck

Even Chuck Schumer condemns Hamas out of hand... is he a neo-conservative too?


Is this the twisted contorted logic you have to pull in order to keep telling yourself that this Imam is moderate?

8/16/2010 2:11:54 PM

Quote :

"So now it is a neo-conservative thing to condemn the terrorist group Hamas?"

If the Imam had to start labeling who is, and who isn't a terrorist (not remotely his job), then he might have to label the IDF and the American Marine Corps as terrorists as well. This would piss off idiots like you who have no idea how to be consistent from one day to the next (so long as the consistency isn't a matter of maintaining your racism).

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 2:20 PM. Reason : Schumer is a Zionist; this issue falls neither on the right or the left.]

8/16/2010 2:18:35 PM

Should Catholic priests decide whether or not Michael Jackson was a pedophile to prove they're "legit"?

8/16/2010 2:26:16 PM

If someone doesn't denounce Hamas that automatically means one supports them correct?

8/16/2010 2:34:20 PM

If explicitly asked to condemn Hamas, who in their right mind would hesitate?

Similarly, yes, I would expect any priest, if explicitly asked, to condemn pedophiles. OF COURSE!!!

WHAT THE F PEOPLE?!

Oh, I'm sorry, I can't condemn Charles Manson because then I would have to compile a list of millions of murderers throughout history and recite a condemnation of each one...


If someone asks you to condemn evil and you refuse, then wtf. You're NOT moderate.

8/16/2010 2:37:26 PM

roflmao

Fail to metacognize.

Sigh. Fucking engineers.

8/16/2010 2:39:25 PM

no metacognization needed...

Question: Do you condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization?
Answer: No

Conclusion: Not moderate

8/16/2010 2:42:38 PM

was he asked to condemn Hamas or if he agreed with the US's labelling of Hamas as terrorists?

8/16/2010 2:46:19 PM

I view both of those questions to be similar enough. Equivocation on either of them is reprehensible.

8/16/2010 3:01:43 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma

8/16/2010 3:04:58 PM

Quote :

"Question: Do you condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization? Answer: No"

Except this is your rephrasing of what happened, and it's not at all accurate

8/16/2010 3:33:45 PM

Seems pretty clear cut to me...

He was given the chance to condemn Hamas. He declined the opportunity.

Not moderate.

8/16/2010 3:41:03 PM

Have you even read a transcript of the event you're pointing out, or have you only read paraphrases by people who share your frothing hatred?

8/16/2010 3:43:16 PM

Of course I have read the transcript.

8/16/2010 3:44:18 PM

Then why do you demonstrate such a basic misunderstanding of the event?

8/16/2010 3:45:21 PM

He was given the chance to condemn Hamas. He declined the opportunity.

Read the fucking transcript.

8/16/2010 3:46:48 PM

I did. Apparently you're the one that didn't.

8/16/2010 3:54:16 PM

lol, just wondering what kind of mental gyrations you had to perform in order to get the idea that he did not decline the opportunity to condemn Hamas...

8/16/2010 3:58:14 PM

Quote :

"What's the time frame for your paranoia so when that time comes you'll know you were wrong about the sky falling?"

I guess that would be when we don't have a national debt crisis looming. We've borrowed an unmanageable amount of money. There is no escape from that reality, and we will have to have a massive recession or a depression to get back to a real economy. There's no plan to pay off the debt, only the assumption that it can be sustained forever. It can't be sustained forever. Just think about how much we owe, the interest on that amount, and how much tax revenue the government gets. It's not going to be pretty. We will either have inflation, or we will default and we will no longer be able to fund government expenditures through bonds, or at least not to the extent we do now. Both of those outcomes would be disasterous for the average person living in this country.

8/16/2010 4:09:01 PM

holy thread derail batman

8/16/2010 5:43:24 PM

I'm sure that mcdanger doesn't mind the derailment, lol

8/16/2010 6:19:32 PM

Quote :

"Boasting a mosque with sports facilities, a theater and possibly day care, the center would be open to all visitors to demonstrate that Muslims are part of their community, not some separate element "This will be a community center for everyone, not just for Muslims, but non-Muslims.""

When I heard about this, I figured this was the goal of the project. I see no reason why people should object to them building an area for everyone. It's not like all Muslims are violent fanatics. Just like not a Islamic fanatics agree with violence.

8/16/2010 6:53:24 PM

I agree, but this imam in particular went out of his way to decline to condemn Hamas when presented with the opportunity. He is not the right man to build this mosque, because if you refuse to condemn terrorists when given the chance, you're not a moderate

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 7:07 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 7:07:14 PM

Dude, are you even a conservative or do you only exist here to argue with and troll liberals?

8/16/2010 7:24:27 PM

I've never seen a conservative with a picture of a statue of Baphomet.


Also I wasn't aware that the person building the Mosque declined to condemn Hamas. Though he could just be scared of backlash. The Ayatollah put a hit on Salmon Rushdie for a long time just because his book title was "The Satanic Verses." He didn't even right anything bad about Islam in it.

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 8:05 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 8:02:29 PM

Harry Reid weighs in on N.Y. mosque: It 'should be built someplace else'
August 16, 2010

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/08/harry-reid-weighs-in-on-ny-mos.html

BIGOT! ISLAMOPHOBE!!!1

Preemptive response:

BIG TENT! RAWR, RAWR!!!1

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 8:15 PM. Reason : See you guys in November! ]

8/16/2010 8:13:39 PM

^ He could easily be a bigot, but he seems to be just as spineless as the Republicans he’s trying to pander to who refuse to stand up for American values.

8/16/2010 8:26:41 PM

^ Well, is he or isn't he? Make a commitment, man. And it always comes back to the "mean old Republicans" for you, doesn't it?

And are 54 percent of Democrats, 82 percent of Republicans, and 70 percent of independents of the 1,009 people polled who said they are against the proposal all bigots?

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/08/11/rel11a1a.pdf

The approach of calling anyone who disagrees with the mosque in question a bigot is just lazy. And I think some of you realize this.

8/16/2010 8:34:16 PM

100% are fascist fucktards

8/16/2010 8:48:17 PM

I feel like if building a Islamic building of prayer generates this much flak, which I can certainly see and understand the reasons for maybe they should just build the community center without the "church."

YMCA's are Young Mens Christian Associations and they don't have built in churches. I must admit, it seems slightly insensitive when people of your religion are blamed for something to build one of your holy buildings in their rubble. Especially when they use their religion as justification for what they've done. That would be kind of like the Catholic church building churches in the areas of the Crusades. Though they might have done that...

8/16/2010 8:48:46 PM

A lot of the opposition is due to the poor reporting of the facts. Once again the conservative media is driving the narrative.

How many of those polled know that there are 2 mosques in the area already (and an arbaic food restaurant), one within 2 blocks of the proposed mosque?

How many of them know that you can’t even see the WTC site from the proposed area, and the building it’s going to be in is the smallest on the block. How many people even care?

If you took a poll asking people if they think any mosque should be built anywhere, how many supporters do you think you’ll get?

That fact that a polling of a population that claims to be 70% Christian don’t want another religion building a house of worship isn’t surprising. it has no bearing on the issue of whether this mosque should be built, because if they own the land, they can do whatever is legally allowed with it.

The people opposing this are religious bigots, but religion often demands this kind of bigotry, so who is surprised by this?

Not to mention that more people support the mosque than oppose it in Manhattan, the area where people were most affected by 9/11, are in the minority:

Quote :

"The Quinnipiac University poll, released Thursday morning, found that 46 percent of Manhattanites support the 13-story mosque and community center, called Cordoba House. Thirty-six percent of Manhattan voters oppose the proposal and 18 percent are undecided. Read more: http://dnainfo.com/20100701/manhattan/manhattanites-support-mosque-near-ground-zero-poll-finds#ixzz0wow6LbOf"

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:01 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 8:50:56 PM

Quote :

"That fact that a polling of a population that claims to be 70% Christian don’t want another religion building a house of worship isn’t surprising. it has no bearing on the issue of whether this mosque should be built, because if they own the land, they can do whatever is legally allowed with it. The people opposing this are religious bigots, but religion often demands this kind of bigotry, so who is surprised by this?"

lol seriously? As if that is not bigoted in and of itself



And uhhhh... Seriously, when did raving liberals develop such a sensitivity to organized religion? Oh I forgot they still hate innocuous Christianity. They only like sharia islam

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:03 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 9:01:07 PM

^^^^ Sounds bigoted.

^^ You're all over the map. If people don't have all the facts, this means that they might simply need more information, right?

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:05 PM. Reason : Manhattan? LOL!]

8/16/2010 9:03:18 PM

In the ideal world, proper information would fix a lot of problems, but when it comes to politics, giving people facts causes them to dig in with their incorrect views: http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2010/07/11/how_facts_backfire/?page=full

If the democrats were smart, they would have framed this is a constitutional issue from the start, painting opponents of the mosque as fascists, just as the right has been trying to paint them as communists. But they started out with it being just a local issue, then the right-wing media ran with it as the supporters hating America/Christians, which is completely illogical.

^^ do you disagree that most major religions, even islam, demand that a practitioner view a non-practitioner as wrong/bad/evil?

^ clearly you are uninformed yourself. I hope you embrace the facts, rather than the cognitive dissonance it can cause, but the whole reason they are building the Cordoba house was for the benefit of the Manhattan population:

http://blog.beliefnet.com/cityofbrass/2010/07/qa-with-sharif-el-gamal-about.html#ixzz0wnpsaed7

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:28 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 9:27:30 PM

even right-wing conservative christians are more liberal than this "moderate" imam!

get real you idiots

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:29 PM. Reason : ]

8/16/2010 9:29:22 PM

I don't want a church within 2 blocks of where the kkk carried out any atrocities!

8/16/2010 9:39:33 PM

Depends on the church... if its a moderate church, like 99% of the churches in this nation, it would be ok.

If it was a church whose pastor refused to condemn the KKK and simply said that their actions were complicated and that the black community had played a part in the atrocities carried out against them, then I think I could see some people getting offended.

8/16/2010 9:42:23 PM

who said 9/11 was ok?

how many synagogues call israel a terrorist nation?

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:46 PM. Reason : 0]

8/16/2010 9:45:45 PM

the imam of this proposed mosque certainly did not say that 9/11 was ok

8/16/2010 9:48:37 PM

thats what you insinuated with your "if the pastor said..." statement. Whats the problem with the location then? Nothing

[Edited on August 16, 2010 at 9:55 PM. Reason : oops]

8/16/2010 9:55:20 PM

That's not what I insinuated.

In fact, I said this:

Quote :

"If it was a church whose pastor refused to condemn the KKK and simply said that their actions were complicated and that the black community had played a part in the atrocities carried out against them, then I think I could see some people getting offended."

The Imam of this mosque has refused to condemn Hamas and has said that the issue of Hamas is "complicated." He also said that the United States had played a role in the atrocities carried out against us in 9/11.

I think I can understand why people are offended that he would then try to build a mosque where he has chosen.

8/16/2010 10:10:13 PM

Hamas has absolutely nothing to do with 9/11 of ground zero. Are you not aware of how the taliban came into power? I thought it was common knowledge that the US was responsible for Osama's power in afghanistan.

People have the thought process of

"Mosque near ground zero? hell naw. It was them damn muslims that attacked us."

8/16/2010 10:16:15 PM

Not really, more like, "Imam who refuses to condemn islamic terrorist groups, building a mosque near ground zero? hell naw. It was Islamic terrorism that occured on 9/11."

8/16/2010 10:18:10 PM

Hey look, Solinari is still insisting that not condemning Hamas is equivalent to endorsing al Qaeda.

Here's the guy's quote regarding Hamas:

Quote :

""Look, I'm not a politician. The issue of terrorism is a very complex question. … There was an attempt in the '90s to have the UN define what terrorism is and say who was a terrorist. There was no ability to get agreement on that. … I am a peace builder. I will not allow anybody to put me in a position where I am seen by any party in the world as an adversary or as an enemy.”"

TURRIST.

8/16/2010 10:32:11 PM